Research into the origins or Christianity strongly suggest that there are no babies only bathwater. Joseph Smiths myth-making leveraged Christian myth-making at the dawn of higher criticism. by | Jun 23, 2022 | replace flower bed with gravel | pickleball courts on staten island | Jun 23, 2022 | replace flower bed with gravel | pickleball courts on staten island what happens if i ignore a ccj; He was going to have him thrown out of the church. In Part 6, we talk to Brent about his interactions and run-ins with prominent Mormon apologists like Daniel Peterson, Lou Midgley and others. [9][10] His father was the managing director of the Temple Department for the LDS Church. Once you start to deconstruct Mormonism, the next step is Christianity, and then the existence of a god, or not There are plenty of stops along that road to hang your hat, but the fastest growing belief system around the existence of god, is atheism. This was an awesome interview. this was fascinating, and I havent got to part 2 yet! [4] Metcalfe had become an ardent supporter of the counterfeited Salamander letter, and hired by Christensen to research the letter. Its a pity Joseph Smith couldnt sit them all down for a good coming-to-Jesus admonishing. Two more parts (3 & 4) to come. brent metcalfe excommunicatedperpetual futures binance. I am still cringing from the realizations about the lack of discernment and the deliberate efforts on the part of the GAs. The failure of faith concept was very interesting, and I can only say but for the grace of God. They buried the Mclellin diaries also.similar thingdidnt like the content. Unresolved: Release in which this issue/RFE will be addressed. Im pretty sure I was standing next to Maxine. Historian Brent Metcalfe says he was fired by the church out of fear he'd publish something they didn't like. In 1994, Professor David Wright of Brandeis University and editor Brent Metcalf were excommunicated for their scripture studies in New Approaches to the Book of Mormon: Explorations in Critical Methodology In 1995, author Janice Allred was excommunicated for her writings about Mother in Heaven. Arent we to try to gain understanding about life and spirituality? If you were to write a book, what aspects of the Hofmann story would you focus on? So my question is, what if the effort for the book of Abraham was an attempt by JS and his close friends to deliver an esoteric masterpiece. If so, what will be the subject? Career Two-time NCAA and Big Ten Champion three-time all-American first wrestler in Big ten history to earn Outstanding Wrestler at the conference meet two straight years (2008, 2009) career winning percentage of .972 (108-3) ranks second all-time at Iowa 2008 Dan Hodge Trophy winner 2008 Jesse Owens Big Ten . "[10], Naifeh, S., & Smith, G. W. (2005). A scene from John Dehlin's upcoming disciplinary council, probably. Good clarification, Doubting Thomas (if that is your real name), :) I have no reason to believe that Jerald Tanner attempted official contact, so Im not sure who Darrick is referring to or what the method of communication entailed. Best wishes, Brent! After admiring the glory of the Lamb for some time, I began to think of the situation my body was in, and rose up to return home. I thought you were very well spoken Brent. Brents work is groundbreaking and reliably fascinating. In fact, it may just be possible that I stood right next to Brent during our official kick off meeting, when Elbert invited his brother Lyle to give us all a magic show. Thank you for sharing it with me. If the Prophet cant see Hoffman as a fraud, why should anyone assume their Bishop/Stake president has any more ability in terms of divinely inspired discernment? She has become the matron saint of Mormon studies (that's a promotion from her previous role as the den mother of Mormon studies). God-belief has also been attributed partly to our brains evolved hyper-tendency to perceiveagency where none exists. 515-294-6532. Categories . Ive always wondered why the most ardently orthodox and pious seem to have the least faith in the divinity and omnipotence of the Lords plan. 2) It seems to me that most of the critiques in the 21st century arent recent developments, rather they already existed for sometimes decades (credit to Brodie and the Tanners for that). No one believed that any one person could do all of those forgeries and build those bombs, and kill those people . A man with boldness of speech, and is often cited by members as one of the favourite apostles to hear from. This is what led me here! In episode #276 of The Jimmy Rex Show, we sit down with a key role in Netflix Documentary Murder Among The Mormons, Brent Metcalfe.Visit and Listen to more. During my 7779 mission I served in two London areas, living first in Kilburn Park and later in Wimbledon. In these two episodes we discuss: 1) The aftermath of the Mark Hofmann bombings, and Brent's. Your excommunication reveals more about your accusers than it says about you. That piqued my interest in the whole sordid affair. What has Brent done to mitigate his ADD? I remember being troubled by the lack of divine discernment that the brethren have/had. Im not sure who made this comment, (I think that it was on another thread),But it went something like thisBased upon the bretherns actions regarding the Salamander letter, The LDS leadership thought that Mark Hofmann was telling the truth and that Joseph Smith was the fraud. He also talks about his early forays into Mormon studies. 52K views 2 years ago Iowa's Brent Metcalf took down Ohio State's Lance Palmer in a thrilling title bout at 149 pounds in the 2010 NCAA wrestling championships. It was stillbecause it all drove from the incredibility of the whole thing. Is it paramount to understand all of these religious histories and come to terms with them or, Brant for people like you and me, would it be better to turn our talents toward uncovering and deciphering Gobekli Tepe, a stone temple complex built 12,000 years ago at the end of the last ice age in Turkey, built by the Watchers of the Book of Enoch and the Anunnaki gods of Sumerian tradition? Brent, are you still working on a Book of Abraham book? document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Jn There are so many parallels between the happenings in my LDS life and Brents, (although nothing to such depth and notoriety) I was drawn to find more information about his life, while he was in the church and out. The second half was fascinating thank you, thank you, thank you for this podcast! But before Brent could truly move on, he had to deal with the emotional turmoil of knowing that he was associated with Mark Hofmann. Life changing! In Part 4, Brent examines some of the issues surrounding traditional approaches to the Book of Mormon. Also, I appreciate you bringing up ADD. ), Visitation of Hertfordshire 1572 & 1634 (London, 1886), 116. I happen to believe so. I served a mission with the missionary mentioned by Brent. After that day I moved to the back of the class and felt like the only straight A student retard at BYU. Truth or legend? John in wonderfully rare form in this oneI love it! Metcalfe is on the editorial board of the John Whitmer Historical Association. Release Calendar Top 250 Movies Most Popular Movies Browse Movies by Genre Top Box Office Showtimes & Tickets Movie News India Movie Spotlight. I shared this source with Mike Quinn when he was writing _Early Mormonism and the Magic World View_. As I went towards the house, this thought came into my mind, why do I feel so different from what I did a short time past : I am unspeakably happy and shall never see trouble again.. He had not let on that the 7th East Press was his brainchild. What if we are all chasing literal meanings of words such as translation, ages and names while in effect they are meant to have symbolic meaning and by this to explain esoteric principles to insiders. 1) In your opinion, which group is currently winning in their arguments regarding the truth claims of church, the critics or the apologetics? As a personal friend and research assistant for both Steve Christensen and Mark Hofmann, Brent Metcalfe watched the whole episode unfold right before his eyes. Thanks for the clarification. Did John take the tapes home to show his wife? But those were interesting times! What did they accomplish by kicking any of you out? I just saw the Netflix Documentary last night. Joyce Skabelund October 9, 1938 January 10, 2023 Our mother, grandma, and friend, Joyce Roth Skabelund, 84, departed this life on 10 January 2023. Rude Dog Never fear! Thanks for the clarification, Brent. Why do you think it is that the church is so fearful of discoveries such as the letters by Mark H ? They have shown time and time again that that is all that matters to them. Your account of why you didnt pursue a doctorate was extremely touching to me as I absolutely admire those that can do the tedium of historical research. Talk about ADD. I was there at the very beginning. I havent listened to MS for several years now, but with Brent being interviewed I couldnt miss this, and I wasnt disappointed. And now, as per reports, Brent Metcalfe has been able to construct a healthy and happy life for himself outside of Mormonism, where he can continue to work as an independent scholar and technical editor without any issues or restrictions. Yeah for Signature Books, Matt Christensen, and the internet!!!!! Im glad you found some of my remarks useful and thanks for the kind comments. I dont agree with all the conclusions of your research but the research is a gift to all of us. The lengthy, five-part series covers Metcalfes childhood in Mormonism, his mission, his time []. Sorry for my language, Im not a native English speaker and there is a limit to what I can express in English. Over the years you just reason, that a faith shouldnt be that complicated. He was basically threatening his entire existence. (paraphrased and likely not the actual quote from Murder Among the Mormons, Netflix documentary). We also talk about the concept of translation, Joseph Smiths views on his translations, the traditional apologetic responses concerning the Book of Abraham (Hugh Nibley, John Gee, and Kerry Muhlestein), as well as the LDS Churchs recent essay on the Book of Abraham. Copyright 2005 - 2023 | Mormon Stories. Part 1 of the interview stuck much closer to home for me. This is one of the best MS interviews I have heard so far. The view of the Lamb on mount Sion gave me joy unspeakable and full of glory. What advice does Brent have for aspiring Mormon historians? Cultural Context Preceding the Book of Mormon, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/493__Brent_Metcalfe_Part_1.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/494__Brent_Metcalfe_Part_2.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-497-BrentMetcalfePt3.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-498-BrentMetcalfePt4.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-499-BrentMetcalfePt5.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-499b-BrentMetcalfePt6.mp3, https://www.utlm.org/onlinebooks/trackingconfessions1.htm, Signature Books Mormon News, October 1317. Read More: Where is Terri Christensen Now? Brent was ultimately excommunicated for editing/authoring this book. Hoffman was Laffertys cell mate. going back ten+ years when we first interacted online (message boards), but this interview gave me many more insights. I think that the group is called FIRM, lead by Rod Meldrum, Jake Hilton, and Wayne May. It instead discusses the fact that the LDS Church keeps some documents secret. Brent H Metcalf, 71 Resides in Salt Lake City, UT Lived In Sandy UT Related To Kyle Metcalf, Molly Metcalf, Kristy Metcalf, Nicole Metcalf Includes Address (3) Phone (4) Email (3) See Results Brent Charles Metcalf, 55 Resides in Lowell, AR Lived In Modesto CA, Oroville CA, Bonney Lake WA Also known as Gary Brent, Metcalf Brent You sound like a delightful guy. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. Im not saying you need to have spiritual experiences to validate your work by any means if the facts are facts, but a higher power confirmation always helps. During the first part of his interview, usually John will ask a question about gaining a testimony while in the Mormon church or have spiritual experiences and then pairing those experiences with the Mormon narrative. Because researchers like me are not taken seriously by them, even if we have serious and significant contributions. Definitely one of my top 10 favorite stories on here. Thanks Brent for sharing your story with usand to John for bringing it to us. I was a newly returned missionary at BYU when all of this took place. Charles, I dont think I threw the baby out with the bathwater since my examination of the Hebrew and Christian scriptures resulted in the same intellectual concerns that I had with LDS scriptural extensions. I think that the LDS churchs main competitor in the marketplace of ideas is not a bigger tent more liberal church, its Agnosticism/atheism. Jerald articulated his concerns in one of his ministrys publications. What is not to love about Johns revelation of your worthy biceps? brent metcalfe excommunicated. Riveting stuff. We were not suppose to discuss the Temple, Blacks and Priesthood, and of course definitely not curtain parts of the church history such as polygamy and polyandry. You are hesitant to answer no evil speaking on what you cant say right ;). Why are they so adamant about excommunicating someone who has a different opinion than they do? Thank you for this very interesting presentation. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. This is one of my all-time favorites. Why do you think the church is so fearful, silencing members and burying facts ? Fixed: Release in which this issue/RFE has been fixed.The release containing this fix may be available for download as an Early Access Release or a General Availability Release. Resolved: Release in which this issue/RFE has been resolved. I suppose the precedent was set by Joseph himself in burning down the Nauvoo Expositor because he didnt like the content, and labelled it anti Mormonit wasnt even, William Law was a believer, who could no longer take Josephs hypocrisy. Privacy Policy. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Hope all is good with you. What is your spirtuality/worldview like post-Mormonism? October 20, 2021. Great interview. Brenten "Brent" Metcalfe joined NW3C after working in law enforcement for over 13 years. He worked directly for Steven Christensen (son of Mr. Mac), one of Mark Hofmann's victims. I just wish that I could undo everything. Despite this, though, Brent found the courage to keep his head held high and began delving deep into the issues surrounding the Book of Mormon, a topic that he had been looking to examine since the early 1980s. In Gnosticism Abraham is not even a real person, the story represents the triumph of spirit over matter and is loaded with hidden symbolic meaning. brent metcalfe excommunicated. Please let us know. I could read fine in private but the social damage was done and anxiety overwhelmed me every time. Serious insight and analysis of the religion Im trying to fit into my new, authentic life. After all, he was the one who had introduced him to Steve Christensen, the first of Marks victims. [9] When it became rumored that Metcalfe had lost his belief in the historical claims of the LDS Church, Christensen terminated the project and fired Metcalfe. January 15, 2015. 2 Introduction at court. I do remember after my baptismal interview having a strong feeling of love and admiration for him because someone so respected thought I was special too. Doxey denied asking about Metcalfe. Tom, have you considered allowing John to interview you? Carl, in parts 3 & 4 of the interview, Ill discuss the BoAbr and some of the challenges that believing scholars face in analyzing its ideational and textual origins. Do you still believe in God, and what type of God? Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Copyright 2005 - 2023 | Mormon Stories. Brent, thanks so much for sharing your tender moments as well. I also wanted to tell you how disturbed I became to my very core about the way you were treated during your working for the church Then the description of the events of day of the bombings, where the meeting was still set with the GA! Do you have any idea what his views are now about the church, what he did, etc.? Its the same adhominem from his whole establishment that shows how much they think they own the intellectual world. Thanks again for your contribution to Mormon Studies and particularly for your diplomatic engagement with your critics. Really, such a great family. It is true that Mac Christiansen did pay for Marks sons mission. Very cool, any personal stories youd like to share? Liked by Brent Metcalfe Experience Practice Lead - Mergers and Acquisitions/Investment Group and Consultant Backswath Management Sep 2022 - Present6 months Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Seeking New. All it is is a continuation of the pain, Brent further added. What do you think about the DCP/Hamblin FARMS implosion? Brent is a fascinating interview for Mormon Stories for many reasons, including: Please post your questions for Brent here. Did any of these projects or research ever prove anything? Id like to hear Mr. Metcalfe address the character, integrity and morals of LDS apostles and prophets with regard to the books of A and M. Regarding the recent essay published by the LDS church regarding the Book of Abraham; what does he think they got right and what does he think is wrong? It was soul-crushing, Brent said. Ack! Whatever the reasons, thanks again for your research that revealed there was MTSTWIS (More-To-See-Than-What-I-Saw). If God will ultimately judge us all, why are mere mortals judging mortals, with the illusion of acting for God? I still remember the demo you and your friends gave in the Rec Hall for Mutual. Perhaps she remembers me, the useless home teacher. From your perspective, what are the 3-5 best pieces of evidence for the historicity of the bom? Thank you so much for being so open and honest that particular issue. Im curious who is singing Lead Kindly Light in this its beautiful. Perhaps it has something to do with the frightening and daunting implications of this inconvenient truth. What an amazing story that Brent was a participant. How was Christensen reimbursed or rewarded by the Church for his document ventures? Surely, anyone who was even moderately sure of themselves in this case would have responded such as this : We have no idea where this letter came from, theres absolutely no truth in it and we disregard it completely.we maintain Josephs account to be true Brent Metcalf's last collegiate wrestling match was a highly anticipated one. New Approaches to the Book of Mormon: Explorations in Critical Methodology, https://www.deseretnews.com/article/865608559/BYU-professor-speaks-on-unnoticed-assumptions-about-the-Book-of-Abraham.html. About a year or so ago when I finally left the church I looked him up to get advice and catch up on old times. Brent Metcalf Resides in Modesto, CA Includes Address (1) Phone (1) See Results Statistics for all 3 Brent Metcalf results: 50 yrs AVERAGE AGE 100% are in their 50s, while the average age is 50. If I applied Vatican II to the full breadth of Catholicism, I clearly misspoke (Im not even sure why I would make such a sweeping claim, so I am a tad mystified). I will start my question with a short story to add some perspective. When Brent Metcalfe compiled a book of essays last year suggesting that Mormonism's founding scripture wasn't the ancient history it purports to be, he expected some criticism.